General Forums >> The Lobby >> speed reduction signs

-11

speed reduction signs

1,593 Views
59 Replies Flag as inappropriate
Photo_user_banned_big

6 posts

back to top

Posted about 1 year ago

 

Heres a speed  question: Girl friend is in a 55 mph zone with correct regulatory sign per the MUTCD ( look it up if you dont know what THAT is ) and she passes a Yellow WARNING  sign with a small reflective sign saying '35 MPH ahead ' enclosed within the yellow warning sign. .About a mile later the speed drops to an actual REGULATORY 35 MPH sign and she gets pulled for 53 after she passes the 35 MPH sign.


I'm thinking that she can beat the ticket as there was no 10 mph  ( sign to 45 ) after the 55 mph sign ,which according to MUTCD is a federal requirement . I looked on the MUTCD manual site and could not find it .


Any help would be great .

1asteriskshield_ezr_max50

1849 posts

back to top
+1

Rated +1 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

 Contact an attorney. 


You can't cure stupid.

White_shirt_max50

4896 posts

back to top
+1

Rated +1 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

Odd first comment/question. No help here. As ajsdaddyBPD commented seek the services of an attorney.

Ggb_max50

5953 posts

back to top
+5

Rated +5 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

Sounds like you've got it pretty well wrapped up. Good job in researching your case.


So ahead and tell the judge what you're conclusions are and demand a dismissal.


And, please, get back to us on this.


We would ALL like to know the outcome.


Thank you.


The Guy !
Photobucket

Honoring the Fallen

25-1-13-a_1__max50

2119 posts

back to top
+2

Rated +2 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

This is NOT a "LOOK FOR ADVISE OR HELP IN BEATING A TRAFFIC CITATION" web site.  If this is what you are seeking, do as ajsdaddyBPD advised and seek the council of an attorney........ A real attorney.


That said:


I would tell my girlfriend to slow down, take a guilty or no contest plea and sign up for traffic school.  Since I (we) can not advise you or your girlfriend as to legal matters without assuming the mantle of being your attorney, I don't know what you or she will do.  You guys will probably take your backyard / internet law degree and proceed to take your chances in court.  I would sure like to be in the gallery or courtroom to see this one argued.  What county / city jurisdiction and court is this going to?  When is the court / trial date?  Maybe you can pass that information on so those of us that can, could show up and watch this trial of the century.  Who wants to bet on how it will turn out?

25-1-13-a_1__max50

2119 posts

back to top
+1

Rated +1 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

Justicechecking says ...



Heres a speed  question: Girl friend is in a 55 mph zone with correct regulatory sign per the MUTCD ( look it up if you dont know what THAT is ) and she passes a Yellow WARNING  sign with a small reflective sign saying '35 MPH ahead ' enclosed within the yellow warning sign. .About a mile later the speed drops to an actual REGULATORY 35 MPH sign and she gets pulled for 53 after she passes the 35 MPH sign.


I'm thinking that she can beat the ticket as there was no 10 mph  ( sign to 45 ) after the 55 mph sign ,which according to MUTCD is a federal requirement . I looked on the MUTCD manual site and could not find it .


Any help would be great .



07-16-13 0520 hours:


In part because I don't want the O/P to go anonymous and delete his post and in part because I want to know where the O/P is getting his information regarding the "MUTCD" or the "Manual of Uniform Traffic Control Devices"  I am quoting the original post from the O/P.  If you plan on fighting this in court, you must have all of your legal codes, statutes and case law to back it up.  You say you "looked it up" and that it is "Federal Law" and then say that when you looked on the MUTCD manual site, you "couldn't find it."

Eagle_and_flag_max50

7643 posts

back to top
+1

Rated +1 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

Here's the bottom line, as you have stated: Your girlfriend was clocked doing 53 mph in a clearly posted 35 mph zone, after having passed a sign that warned her of the lowered speed. Go pay the ticket. OR, take it to trial, fight it, lose and then pay the ticket.


Incidentally, I'm not familiar with any Federal Requirement making it mandatory to drop the speed 10 mph at a time. Ever come up on a construction zone on the interstate? It's not unusual for the speed there to drop from 65 mph to 45 mph.


In GOD We Trust (All others get searched, then checked through NCIC)

MODERATOR #10

Photobucket

IN HONOR OF OUR FALLEN

Female_bodysurfer_max50

7903 posts

back to top
+1

Rated +1 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

I have a VERY dim recollection of reference to that law, but is it an urban myth???  I will bet money if I look it up I will find it also contains  language that permits adjusting posting foroptimum public safety according to a set of conditions.


The OP might fight it and find herself jumping down a rabbit hole only to arrive back at the same spot - that the charge of negligence stands. 


I too am curious what the outcome may be.

Wredcedar_max50

1237 posts

back to top
+1

Rated +1 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

36TR says ...



Here's the bottom line, as you have stated: Your girlfriend was clocked doing 53 mph in a clearly posted 35 mph zone, after having passed a sign that warned her of the lowered speed. Go pay the ticket. OR, take it to trial, fight it, lose and then pay the ticket.


Incidentally, I'm not familiar with any Federal Requirement making it mandatory to drop the speed 10 mph at a time. Ever come up on a construction zone on the interstate? It's not unusual for the speed there to drop from 65 mph to 45 mph.



I believe the requirement is that the speed can only be dropped 10 mph. w/o a sign.  A greater drop (ie 55 to 35), requires a warning sign of the impending change in speed.  BUMP TheSarge and let us know how you come out.

Eagle_and_flag_max50

7643 posts

back to top
+1

Rated +1 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

Cedardale says ...



36TR says ...



Here's the bottom line, as you have stated: Your girlfriend was clocked doing 53 mph in a clearly posted 35 mph zone, after having passed a sign that warned her of the lowered speed. Go pay the ticket. OR, take it to trial, fight it, lose and then pay the ticket.


Incidentally, I'm not familiar with any Federal Requirement making it mandatory to drop the speed 10 mph at a time. Ever come up on a construction zone on the interstate? It's not unusual for the speed there to drop from 65 mph to 45 mph.



I believe the requirement is that the speed can only be dropped 10 mph. w/o a sign.  A greater drop (ie 55 to 35), requires a warning sign of the impending change in speed.  BUMP TheSarge and let us know how you come out.



Makes sense. Good point!!


In GOD We Trust (All others get searched, then checked through NCIC)

MODERATOR #10

Photobucket

IN HONOR OF OUR FALLEN

25-1-13-a_1__max50

2119 posts

back to top
+2

Rated +2 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

36TR says ...



Cedardale says ...



36TR says ...



Here's the bottom line, as you have stated: Your girlfriend was clocked doing 53 mph in a clearly posted 35 mph zone, after having passed a sign that warned her of the lowered speed. Go pay the ticket. OR, take it to trial, fight it, lose and then pay the ticket.


Incidentally, I'm not familiar with any Federal Requirement making it mandatory to drop the speed 10 mph at a time. Ever come up on a construction zone on the interstate? It's not unusual for the speed there to drop from 65 mph to 45 mph.



I believe the requirement is that the speed can only be dropped 10 mph. w/o a sign.  A greater drop (ie 55 to 35), requires a warning sign of the impending change in speed.  BUMP TheSarge and let us know how you come out.



Makes sense. Good point!!



From what I can tell when I looked at the MUTCD web site, the purpose of the MUTCB was to make uniform and standardised signage from sea to shining sea.  As of 1971ish, all stop signs across the nation look the same as do the speed limit signs, freeway exit signs and all  other warning signs.  They mandate the size and shape of the sign, the size, font and colors of the letters and the colors associated with each type of sign.  While the MUTCD is the federal mandate, each state can make its own but they follow the MUTCD almost to the letter in conformity.


It would appear that the O/P is trying to make us believe that his girlfriend was the victim of a speed trap.  The O/P clearly stated that there was a distinct warning sign that was in clear view, warning drivers of the 35 MPH speed limit that was ahead.  The O/P girlfriend chose to ignore the sign and and entered the 35 MPH speed zone at 53 MPH when she was stopped and subsequently issued the appropriate citation pursuant to the violation of the posted speed limit.  There was and is no trap.


I find the defendant GUILTY

Silver_warrior_max50

1463 posts

back to top
+2

Rated +2 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

Must have overlooked the part that the federal government does not have the authority to lord over the states with laws pertaining to highway statutes.  They do their best to get the states to conform to their (the feds) idea of good ideas for laws through requests and suggestions.  However, when that fails they threaten the states with withholding highway funds if the states don't comply.  This is what they did to drop the speed limit in the 1970's to 55. . . . .seatbelt laws. . . . .drinking age to 21. . . . .drinking "per se" limit to .08. . . . .and the list goes on and on.


No, the states have the ability to make their own laws without the input from the feds.  Me thinks your girlfriend is out of luck, but don't let me stop you from tilting at windmills.  Good luck.


I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, and I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do these things to other people and I expect the same from them.

John Bernard Books, from "The Shootist"

25-1-13-a_1__max50

2119 posts

back to top
+1

Rated +1 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

I m still waiting for the O/P to respond and argue his case.  I guess we'll just wait.  cricket, cricket, cricket........

Female_bodysurfer_max50

7903 posts

back to top
+1

Rated +1 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

Thumbnail_max50

1299 posts

back to top
+1

Rated +1 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

I don't know of any such regulation, as the OP is referring to here.  As 36TR says "ever been through a construction zone?"  I would love to hear the outcome on this as well....

Newpatch_sq90_max50

6010 posts

back to top
+1

Rated +1 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

Read the MUTCD.  It clearly states that the speed sign is a reglatory sign.  There is no reduction speed signs necessary. The fact the sign states 35 mph, is all they need to post. The yellow sign is an advisatory sign, and is just that, advising the the speed is reduced ahead. It doesn't matter what the speed is reduced to to be enforced.  Once she passes the speed sign of 35mph that is the speed limit, under Prima Facia law.  The fact the sign says 35mph, is the speed.  Fight it if you want, but it's in the book.


Photobucket
In Memory of the Fallen Officers

MODERATOR 3

Tribal_cat_tattoo__2__max50

1910 posts

back to top
+1

Rated +1 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

Well, I was just in TN... the speed dropped from a 60 to a 45 in several areas.. so I don't know what this guy is talking about.


"Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives." - Ronald Reagan

25-1-13-a_1__max50

2119 posts

back to top
+1

Rated +1 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

Catwoman911 says ...



Well, I was just in TN... the speed dropped from a 60 to a 45 in several areas.. so I don't know what this guy is talking about.



It would appear that the O/P doesn't know either....... just sayin'

0813100309a_max50

16 posts

back to top
+1

Rated +1 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

this posted speed reduction by numbers of ten is a state law in some states, ive had a few fellow officers lose due to this.. exception to this is construction zones, school zones, off ramps, and warning signs prior to the actual speed sign. we have a few rural roads that will have a speed change of 20mph for no apearant reason it appears, but these zones now are kinda like the fruit of the forbiden tree if you are running traffic.

Photo_user_banned_big

6 posts

back to top
-2

Rated -2 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

 I'm back and I have left it to G/F to argue the point -at least untill she might give up her research on the states' law. Then I will step in.,contact the National Motorist Association ( I'm a member) and get their help. As I recall, a member DID beat a ticket using the  ' 10 MPH step down . arguement and WON a few years back.


The incident happened just east of a town called Liberty in S.C. on hwy 93 . G/F was going west bound , and after this happend she has spoken to others who have been nailed in this speed trap ( ?)....


 She has requested a jury trial.


Thanks for all the input and I will let ya'll know the deal about picking "forbidden fruit "  ( ?)


PS  -  I got stopped by a local yokel ( sheriff ) who had a report that I was carrying a gun while on my motorcycle .He wanted to arrest me . I advised HIM of the law .He  tried to get a straight answer after calling the 4 magistrates around here . NONE could find the law ( !) section 16-23-16 says I can carry if gun is  " ... temporarily or permanatly attached to the motorcycle ..." I'm REALLY tired of the people around here allowing the Law to push 'em around like sheeple .Ignorance is NOT bliss .


Want to know about the Enforcers around here ? Google Beckey Girrard cheif magistrate Oconee County .She got caught on VIDEO tearing the roof off another magistrates convertable and pouring Coke in the interior ,while at a MAGISTRATES CONVENTION !


Thanks again for the replies .


 

Female_bodysurfer_max50

7903 posts

back to top
+1

Rated +1 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

7/29/2013 3:47 PM PST


I'm curious. Do you find 'local yokels' epidemic in your area alone or do you find this kind of thing to be a systemic problem?  If so, would changes in federal law help?


Justicechecking says ...



 I'm back and I have left it to G/F to argue the point -at least untill she might give up her research on the states' law. Then I will step in.,contact the National Motorist Association ( I'm a member) and get their help. As I recall, a member DID beat a ticket using the  ' 10 MPH step down . arguement and WON a few years back.


The incident happened just east of a town called Liberty in S.C. on hwy 93 . G/F was going west bound , and after this happend she has spoken to others who have been nailed in this speed trap ( ?)....


 She has requested a jury trial.


Thanks for all the input and I will let ya'll know the deal about picking "forbidden fruit "  ( ?)


PS  -  I got stopped by a local yokel ( sheriff ) who had a report that I was carrying a gun while on my motorcycle .He wanted to arrest me . I advised HIM of the law .He  tried to get a straight answer after calling the 4 magistrates around here . NONE could find the law ( !) section 16-23-16 says I can carry if gun is  " ... temporarily or permanatly attached to the motorcycle ..." I'm REALLY tired of the people around here allowing the Law to push 'em around like sheeple .Ignorance is NOT bliss .


Want to know about the Enforcers around here ? Google Beckey Girrard cheif magistrate Oconee County .She got caught on VIDEO tearing the roof off another magistrates convertable and pouring Coke in the interior ,while at a MAGISTRATES CONVENTION !


Thanks again for the replies .


 


25-1-13-a_1__max50

2119 posts

back to top
+2

Rated +2 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

Justicechecking says ...



 I'm back and I have left it to G/F to argue the point -at least untill she might give up her research on the states' law. Then I will step in.,contact the National Motorist Association ( I'm a member) and get their help. As I recall, a member DID beat a ticket using the  ' 10 MPH step down . arguement and WON a few years back.


The incident happened just east of a town called Liberty in S.C. on hwy 93 . G/F was going west bound , and after this happend she has spoken to others who have been nailed in this speed trap ( ?)....


 She has requested a jury trial.


Thanks for all the input and I will let ya'll know the deal about picking "forbidden fruit "  ( ?)


PS  -  I got stopped by a local yokel ( sheriff ) who had a report that I was carrying a gun while on my motorcycle .He wanted to arrest me . I advised HIM of the law .He  tried to get a straight answer after calling the 4 magistrates around here . NONE could find the law ( !) section 16-23-16 says I can carry if gun is  " ... temporarily or permanatly attached to the motorcycle ..." I'm REALLY tired of the people around here allowing the Law to push 'em around like sheeple .Ignorance is NOT bliss .


Want to know about the Enforcers around here ? Google Beckey Girrard cheif magistrate Oconee County .She got caught on VIDEO tearing the roof off another magistrates convertable and pouring Coke in the interior ,while at a MAGISTRATES CONVENTION !


Thanks again for the replies .


 



07-29-13 0338 hrs


It would appear the O/P has an agenda and is NOT seeking the advice of the PL members as much as he is attempting to tell LE in general what his interpitation of the law is.

Ba_old_glory_max50

902 posts

back to top
+2

Rated +2 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

I deal with folks on a daily basis who either can't/won't read or comprehend signs. I swear it's an epidemic.

Patrolcar_pic_max50

956 posts

back to top
+5

Rated +5 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

Justicechecking says ...



PS  -  I got stopped by a local yokel ( sheriff ) who had a report that I was carrying a gun while on my motorcycle .He wanted to arrest me . I advised HIM of the law .He  tried to get a straight answer after calling the 4 magistrates around here . NONE could find the law ( !) section 16-23-16 says I can carry if gun is  " ... temporarily or permanatly attached to the motorcycle ..." I'm REALLY tired of the people around here allowing the Law to push 'em around like sheeple .Ignorance is NOT bliss .


Want to know about the Enforcers around here ? Google Beckey Girrard cheif magistrate Oconee County .She got caught on VIDEO tearing the roof off another magistrates convertable and pouring Coke in the interior ,while at a MAGISTRATES CONVENTION !


Thanks again for the replies .



 


Just a little friendly advice here....referring to any officer by whatever slang people like to use nowadays is a good way to lose respect. Remember, you're on a forum called "POLICElink." I personally find a good amount of those terms pretty offensive.


Second.....what is your point in telling us your story about how you had to tell an officer what the law was? contrary to what many would like to believe, we are HUMAN just like everyone else. We make mistakes too sometimes, and unless someone is like rainman, I highly doubt every officer out there knows every single statute word for word. (maybe UncleDennis does) You come off as being a bit arrogant yourself by saying, "He wanted to arrest me. I showed HIM the law. Maybe it's not your intent, because it's hard to read someone by reading text, but you're coming across as a bit of a prick.


"People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf. "

White_shirt_max50

4896 posts

back to top
+3

Rated +3 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

I discovered a flaw in the OP's follow up comments. He stated his girlfriend requested a jury trial. I assume the speeding summons was issued by a municipal police officer. In my state and I would imagine it is the same in most states, one cannot request a jury trial for a municipal traffic summons. Only after they are found guilty can they appeal to a circuit court. Then a jury trial will hear the matter. Regardless of the outcome the OP will apprise us  of a not guilty finding. He comes across somewhat cocky. I failed to mention the defendant can waive the municipal court and request the next higher court to hear the matter.

-24 posts

back to top
Rate

Rate This | Posted about 1 year ago

 

I'm bumping my good friend uncleD.I recognized the O.P's arrogance when he did his original post and called him on it.He then reworded(re-worked )said original post ergo I deleted my post.He also states he was stopped by a Local Yokel en re to his carrying a handgun while on his bike  and called him a Deputy Sheriff.If he wishes to speak trucker lingo a Local Yokel is NOT a Deputy Sheriff it is a Police Officer.A Deputy Sheriff is called a County Mounty,as a State Patrolman is called a Smokey.Has been obvious to me from the get -go ,he simply has issues with leos.How many,many times have we leos stopped people with this attitude who "KNOW THE LAW" and it takes about five seconds for them to make an a$$ of themselves.

Caduceus_max50

2196 posts

back to top
Rate

Rate This | Posted about 1 year ago

 

Jonas says ...



I deal with folks on a daily basis who either can't/won't read or comprehend signs. I swear it's an epidemic.



The only people who read signs are the people who put them up!


Doc


Quis custodiet ipsos custodes.
Troll Hunter, "Doc", LEO Supporter.
It's not the falling down, it's the staying down.

25-1-13-a_1__max50

2119 posts

back to top
+2

Rated +2 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

headbrer says ...



Jonas says ...



I deal with folks on a daily basis who either can't/won't read or comprehend signs. I swear it's an epidemic.



The only people who read signs are the people who put them up!


Doc



This is not always true or we would not have this problem......



or



and obviously they did not do well at



 


Female_bodysurfer_max50

7903 posts

back to top
+2

Rated +2 | Posted about 1 year ago

 

Bump this show of remarkable restraint.  I would have described the OP as a 'prink', wich is something between a prick and a dink.


Jkaz232 says ...



Justicechecking says ...



PS  -  I got stopped by a local yokel ( sheriff ) who had a report that I was carrying a gun while on my motorcycle .He wanted to arrest me . I advised HIM of the law .He  tried to get a straight answer after calling the 4 magistrates around here . NONE could find the law ( !) section 16-23-16 says I can carry if gun is  " ... temporarily or permanatly attached to the motorcycle ..." I'm REALLY tired of the people around here allowing the Law to push 'em around like sheeple .Ignorance is NOT bliss .


Want to know about the Enforcers around here ? Google Beckey Girrard cheif magistrate Oconee County .She got caught on VIDEO tearing the roof off another magistrates convertable and pouring Coke in the interior ,while at a MAGISTRATES CONVENTION !


Thanks again for the replies .



 


Just a little friendly advice here....referring to any officer by whatever slang people like to use nowadays is a good way to lose respect. Remember, you're on a forum called "POLICElink." I personally find a good amount of those terms pretty offensive.


Second.....what is your point in telling us your story about how you had to tell an officer what the law was? contrary to what many would like to believe, we are HUMAN just like everyone else. We make mistakes too sometimes, and unless someone is like rainman, I highly doubt every officer out there knows every single statute word for word. (maybe UncleDennis does) You come off as being a bit arrogant yourself by saying, "He wanted to arrest me. I showed HIM the law. Maybe it's not your intent, because it's hard to read someone by reading text, but you're coming across as a bit of a prick.


Female_bodysurfer_max50

7903 posts

back to top
Rate

Rate This | Posted about 1 year ago

 

I noticed it too uncledennis, but figured Jojo the Justice Checker resides in a mythical state.


uncledennis1 says ...



I discovered a flaw in the OP's follow up comments. He stated his girlfriend requested a jury trial. I assume the speeding summons was issued by a municipal police officer. In my state and I would imagine it is the same in most states, one cannot request a jury trial for a municipal traffic summons. Only after they are found guilty can they appeal to a circuit court. Then a jury trial will hear the matter. Regardless of the outcome the OP will apprise us  of a not guilty finding. He comes across somewhat cocky. I failed to mention the defendant can waive the municipal court and request the next higher court to hear the matter.


Next Page >