General Forums >> General Discussions >> Poll: Should Police/Sheriffs Volunteers be issued Bullet Resistant Vests?

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Poll: Should Police/Sheriffs Volunteers be issued Bullet Resistant Vests?

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Poll: Should LE Volunteers be issued bullet resistant vests?

041711141420_max50

13 posts

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Posted almost 3 years ago

 

Includes:


Volunteers In Police Services (VIPS)


Senior Volunteers (CHP)


Police Explorers 


Or even general ride alongs. What is your departments policy on bullet resistant vests on ride alongs? 

Img_1050_max50

1867 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

Depends on department policy. If full time officer have to purchase vest then so should volunteers.

Silver_warrior_max50

1424 posts

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+6

Rated +6 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

If you are going to wear the target (i.e. uniform), then you should wear the vest.  Shouldn't matter if you are a fully sworn officer or not.  Bad guy really won't care if the person in the uniform is an officer or not. . . . .they just hate the uniform and what it stands for. . . .them behind bars.

Profile1_max50

118 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

Bump Beowulf! My department has vests for explorers to use on ridealongs, but we don't use them at public events. It would be nice to have vests issued alongside bagdes and redguns, but at around $800 a piece, it's just not gonna happen.


"Any sudden hand movements will render your birth certificate a useless piece of scrap paper."

Me__mr

1014 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

The way things are today, absolutely.


A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.

"I'd rather be a failure at something I enjoy than be a success at something I hate." -- George Burns

"A pessimist complains about the wind, an optimist expects it to change and a leader adjusts the sails."

1979_max50

3250 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

What beowold said. The bad guys don't distinguish or care if you are paid, sworn, or not. You are a cop as far as they are concerned.

Wredcedar_max50

1226 posts

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+2

Rated +2 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

IMO explorers and anyone else in uniform should be furnished a vest, if nothing else a recently expired one, as it has been shown that  most vests have a much longer useful life that 5 years, and most agencies repace them at 5 years or less.  I do not know if  funds for vests are available to explorers, there are groups out there who help depts get vests (via grant or partial payment) for their officers.


PCSO there are vests available for much less than $ 800, even a level II w/o insert would be much better thant nothing.

Imagesca4xarl3gatekeeper911_max50

505 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

 Absolutely!!!! ..... it should not even be a Question! ..... it should be in every Budget!.... Cut the Salary of everyone in City Hall if need be..... it could be a matter of Life and Death!

Rcsd04_max600_max50

617 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

 Yes! If you were a uniform, badge and weapon their needs to be a vest worn. Explorers should wear,but due to department funding I know that will probably never happen. As I was told when I was in an explorer post, a criminal doesn't see the difference in uniform color, just another badge and body in uniform. Explorers are lucky to have just lost one in line of duty with all that they do. When I was in I was only given a vest only when I went out to ride, but the one they gave a swear it wouldn't stop a bb. 


You wouldn't go in there for a million bucks...A Cop does it for less...A Reserve does it for free....

25-1-13-a_1__max50

2102 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

If you wear the uniform, you should wear a vest.  Is the department obligated to purchase and issue a vest to the volunteer?  Only if it states so in department policy.  If no policy exists or if policy requires the sworn officers to purchase their own vests, then there is no obligation for the department to provide one for the volunteer.  The volunteer might consider asking the supervisor over the volunteers if there are any extra vests available for use when on duty, on  a ride along or any other similar event or sctivity.  If no extra vests were available abd I were the volunteer, I would make every effort that I can think of to purchase my own.  Keep in mind that the wolves make no distinction between who is or who isn't sworn or who is a volunteer or the real deal.  As far as they are concerned, you are a representative of the department and therefpre, stand in their way.  If you wear the uniform, you should wear the vest.  It is a small investment that could pay huge dividends by saving your life.  So once again......... IF YOU WEAR THE UNIFORM, YOU SHOULD WEAR THE VEST.

375956_401447159923274_1109023972_n_max50

558 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

I volunteered for my local Sheriff's Office for 3 years, we were mandated to wear a vest when we were out on patrol which including directing traffic or participating in a special event.


We weren't issued new vest but used ones, I was the only female at the time, and our deputies are very tall and very muscular so the guys I volunteered with were able to wear the hand-me-downs. But not the female lol. My Sergeant put a requisition into the deputy Chief for a new vest for me. The deputy Chief came back with a memo saying that; "If she is afraid to go out on patrol without a vest, maybe she should stay inside and put her time in, in the office." Probably a very politically incorrect thing to write in a memo.

 


To make a long story short, a vest was found for me,  came out of the trunk of a detectives car, complete with blood stains. I was told by an EMT to make sure if I was shot it was done from a long distance since the vest wouldn't stop a close range bullet.


And yes I wore that vest every time I went out on Patrol, whether it was 105 degrees or 10 degrees.


But yes anyone who puts on a uniform whether they are a volunteer or sworn really needs to wear a vest.


"God created man, Sam Colt made them equal. ..... "

“No amount of law enforcement can solve a problem that goes back to the family.” ~ J. Edgar Hoover

"The cure for crime is not the electric chair, but the high chair." ~ J. Edgar Hoover

25-1-13-a_1__max50

2102 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

Eilene says ...



I volunteered for my local Sheriff's Office for 3 years, we were mandated to wear a vest when we were out on patrol which including directing traffic or participating in a special event.


We weren't issued new vest but used ones, I was the only female at the time, and our deputies are very tall and very muscular so the guys I volunteered with were able to wear the hand-me-downs. But not the female lol. My Sergeant put a requisition into the deputy Chief for a new vest for me. The deputy Chief came back with a memo saying that; "If she is afraid to go out on patrol without a vest, maybe she should stay inside and put her time in, in the office." Probably a very politically incorrect thing to write in a memo.

 


edit



It would seem if you were mandated by policy to wear a vest when out on patrol, directing traffic and participating in special events then the Deputy Chief is not only politically incorrect by making such a statement but in direct violation of policy that he is supposed to enforce and setting the department up for some huge liability if something were to happen.  His memo would be an admissible document in any litigation.  Fortunately for you, your family, the Deputy Chief and the department, nothing happened.

Batman_max600_1__max50

3021 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

Your Office does not require a Reserve Deputy to wear a vest but they are provided. When I was a Reserve Deputy I bought my first vest at a Pawn shop for $75.00. An Officer hawked it and did not come back and get it. My wife made a new carrier and I wore it until I got my new one when I started full time. Anything is better than nothing.  


Bad stuff happens to good people, handle it and overcome.
My motto for life:
Let go and let GOD,
Only HE can control everything.

1067_med_max50

288 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

If it was provided for the ride along, I would wear it for sure.


I don't believe in an eye for an eye...I believe in two eyes for an eye.

375956_401447159923274_1109023972_n_max50

558 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

Thanks for agreeing. I eventually did get a vest, but according to an EMT I knew it wasn't worth putting on, but I wore it no matter how hot it got. Between the Smokey the Bear hot and the vest summer was almost unbearable. The Deputy Chief liked his drink, he was the only one that didn't become PC when it mandated by the Federal Government.


 


SkoolCop says ...



Eilene says ...



I volunteered for my local Sheriff's Office for 3 years, we were mandated to wear a vest when we were out on patrol which including directing traffic or participating in a special event.


We weren't issued new vest but used ones, I was the only female at the time, and our deputies are very tall and very muscular so the guys I volunteered with were able to wear the hand-me-downs. But not the female lol. My Sergeant put a requisition into the deputy Chief for a new vest for me. The deputy Chief came back with a memo saying that; "If she is afraid to go out on patrol without a vest, maybe she should stay inside and put her time in, in the office." Probably a very politically incorrect thing to write in a memo.

 


edit



It would seem if you were mandated by policy to wear a vest when out on patrol, directing traffic and participating in special events then the Deputy Chief is not only politically incorrect by making such a statement but in direct violation of policy that he is supposed to enforce and setting the department up for some huge liability if something were to happen.  His memo would be an admissible document in any litigation.  Fortunately for you, your family, the Deputy Chief and the department, nothing happened.



"God created man, Sam Colt made them equal. ..... "

“No amount of law enforcement can solve a problem that goes back to the family.” ~ J. Edgar Hoover

"The cure for crime is not the electric chair, but the high chair." ~ J. Edgar Hoover

375956_401447159923274_1109023972_n_max50

558 posts

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Rate

Rate This | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

I've been on more ride alongs than I can count or care to admit. It wasn't being shot at that worried me, it was those Deputies who thought it was fun to try to scare me by doing at least 100mph on the highway. I could have used a crash helmet, though. What the "boys" eventually realized is I don't scare all that easily.


 


 


rarebit says ...



If it was provided for the ride along, I would wear it for sure.



"God created man, Sam Colt made them equal. ..... "

“No amount of law enforcement can solve a problem that goes back to the family.” ~ J. Edgar Hoover

"The cure for crime is not the electric chair, but the high chair." ~ J. Edgar Hoover

375956_401447159923274_1109023972_n_max50

558 posts

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Rate

Rate This | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

I have to disagree with you on this one. Volunteers are just that volunteers most of us didn't have the money to purchase our own vest which is the first point, the second point how many of us knew how long we were going to be in the program. Life happens, we all had jobs, kids, family obligations.


We were issued used vests, the cost didn't come out of the agency's budget, and since we weren't sworn or permitted to carry a weapon (flashlights don't count). Some kind of protection was needed, because my argument was that you dress us like deputies, we drive a marked cruiser, and wear a badge, hence we are targets.


As with our uniforms, which were provided by the SO, a vest is part of the uniform.


Irishcop1961 says ...



Depends on department policy. If full time officer have to purchase vest then so should volunteers.



"God created man, Sam Colt made them equal. ..... "

“No amount of law enforcement can solve a problem that goes back to the family.” ~ J. Edgar Hoover

"The cure for crime is not the electric chair, but the high chair." ~ J. Edgar Hoover

Sfa_iv_max50

265 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

When I volunteered, I bought my own so this question would never be a problem. I purchased most of my gear to keep the budget to those who sereved full time. One of the reason to voluteer is to help the budget.


God Bless
The father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit
Be with you always.
Go In Peace and Serve with Love

Tribal_cat_tattoo__2__max50

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

I think they should be issued vests.. but my department does not issue them.. I think that is a little bit on the crazy side. 


"Government's first duty is to protect the people, not run their lives." - Ronald Reagan

1979_max50

3250 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

Since this subject has come up again in a poll allow me to further opine, If you are a reserve Officer OR wearing the uniform of a LEO then you should be wearing a vest, period. Ridealongs are not wearing a uniform and should not be issued a vest. Just costs too much in today's cash-strapped world. Ridealongs should not be allowed to respond to dangerous situations like robbery, housebreaking, man with a gun, etc.

Fa03_max50

18 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

i belive in wearing the bullet proof vest and it should be mandatory even if you're a volunteer or not  in uniform or on the job in plain clothes .


SAFETY FIRST !!!!!!

Wredcedar_max50

1226 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

Robocop33 says ...



Since this subject has come up again in a poll allow me to further opine, If you are a reserve Officer OR wearing the uniform of a LEO then you should be wearing a vest, period. Ridealongs are not wearing a uniform and should not be issued a vest. Just costs too much in today's cash-strapped world. Ridealongs should not be allowed to respond to dangerous situations like robbery, housebreaking, man with a gun, etc.



Even in civilian clothes, a ride along is normally in a marked unit, if there are old/extra vests available, one should be offered to the ride along IMO.  Just being in a marked unit may make you a potential target, and vests also help in vehicle crashes.

Bronzestarribbon_max50

1931 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

Absolutely, if the agency has a sanctioned volunteer group and they are seen in the community in a uniform or out with officers doing their jobs then you should be issued a vest.  As was said earlier, some agencies, smaller or large may make the person purchase their own, but if you are in the program for the long haul, then the purchase is a life saving investment.


Many agencies can qualify for programs that assist their officers in purchasing vests and if the agency has a forfeiture fund from illegal monies or drugs, then the agency can purchase equipment for the agency using that money.  Check into what your agency has to offer.  Best of luck...

827-2294l_max50

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

Anytime you are in uniform you ARE a target. 


Our Reserves are Sworn, and carry sidearms. 

3225_541527388055_44403931_31987246_224403_n_max50

79 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

When i think LE volunteers i think Reserve units. those yes. Should a pd provide vests to Explorers, COPS, and what not......if it has the resourses then outstanding, however i don't see it being needed piece of equipment being the fact that they are not confronting suspects. however if they have one then they should wear it when out doing their service. However being in and around policing for over 20 years, starting out as an explorer, i have never felt that i was in harm or have heard of any of them with a very few(2) expections of being harmed.

Wolfspirit_max50

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

Yes, you are a moving target when in uniform, of course you should be as protected as possible.....


BE Safe......


"It's Never To Late To Be What You Could Have Been"

Esu_patch_max50

72 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

Anyone who doesnt thnik these people should have a vest should watch the video that was posted here a few weeks ago, It shows 2 NYC Auxiliary Officers gunned down by a perp from a robbery. Our Aux Officers are unarmed and in the past probably only got an old vest that was lying around if they were lucky. These 2 Aux. Officers had no vests.

Jerry_max50

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

Absolutely yes.  The police agency I currently work for lost a Community Service Officer (non-commissioned, unarmed, but wearing a CSO uniform) in 1992 when a mental subject with a warrant is believed to have mistaken her for a police officer.  The CSO was shot and killed with a shotgun.  Though a bullet-proof vest would have not saved the victim due to the location of her injuries, having these volunteers wear a vest may very well keep them safe from such an assault.

Psd_stamp_logo_max50

11 posts

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Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

We (as a department) experimented with this in the early 90's. Volunteers as a whole were more a positive role in the community. They were not (generally) viewed as responders and thus were not subject to the potential violence. Having said that, I understand the roles of the "police volunteer" has changed, from issuing parking tickets (which in California became a civial procedure), vacation watches, with the possibility of stumbling into a in progress burglary, and community service programs such as outreach, senior bag lunch program etc. We did not put vests on them at the time, but offered the group as a whole the idea of wearing them. They were not interested in wearing them and we accepted that as a rule or policy.


Our department does furnish vests to sworn personnel, the city will furnish you with a new vest every 5 years, or God forbid, when one becomes unserviceable because of use. Older vests were issued to Explorers, to wear when on ride-alongs or while working special events. Explorers were dressed in uniform (albeit a light blue shirt in contrast to our dark blue) but wore Sam Browne, handcuffs, flashlight etc. Most of them interacted with the public while on ride-alongs and were very active within the deparment and community. The Explorer program went through some very intense training (including a live-in 5 day academy), background invest and each individual was screened etc. The amount of interaction they had was dicated by Boy Scout policy, Department Policy and the individual officer the exlporer was riding with.


The volunteers wear white shirts, blue pants, in stark contrast to the patrol uniform, their role has been pretty clearly defined within the community and as of now, they are still not furnished, nor asked to wear vests.


I understand there are a myriad of issues with general idea and this is in no way my "opinion" as to what a particular department or volunteer program should or should not do. That, hopefully, will be dictated by research, knowledge of common practices and just plain good old common sense.


There is a great need for a sarcasm font.

1979_max50

3250 posts

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+1

Rated +1 | Posted almost 3 years ago

 

Vests are a wonderful thing and have saved many lives in the past including yours truly BUT, understand they are NOT bullet-proof vests and ONLY work when you are shot or struck in the vest at least 1" from the edge and even then only with a certain cal. of bullet. It also still hurts like hell to be shot while wearing one even if the round does not penetrate the vest. There is no such thing as bullet-proof! Like I said, they are really a wonderful item and I wore one from the moment that they became available to us and wore it every single day I put my uniform on which turned out to be almost ever day! I started my police career before vests were available. Still I never deluded myself into thinking that it would save my life if shot at. My understanding was not to get shot at in the first place. <VBG> My vest saved my life during a motorcycle crash by keeping all those pointy things from sticking into my body and to lessen the blunt trauma in my torso area. Without it the internal injuries would have been fatal. Additionally it served me well during the many times I was punched by some very large and very strong people, not to mention the time a woman stuck a fork in my chest pretty much over the heart, and the time I was hit across the back with a damn post! Those may not have been fatal injuries but they damn well would have hurt, a lot!


Wear them but never allow yourself to be complacent enough to think that because you are wearing a vest you are safe and bullet-PROOF! Just bullet-RESISTANT in certain areas of your body. Also take care of your vest and observe the manufacturer's instructions on cleaning and washing. I know mine was not to be washed, just the covering. Not sure what the new ones are like but still, misuse and poor treatment can cause them to degrade.

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