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Push for Statutory Authority HR 324

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8494_bozo_pd_max600_max50

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Posted over 3 years ago

 

DOD Police Officers are more active now than ever before in regards to statutory authority.  HR 324 was introduced by Rep Bob Filner in the 112th Congress (formerly HR 675). The 3 major DOD Police Unions (IBPO, AFGE, and FOP) are on board and lobbying in congress daily.  There seems to be a single focus on this legislation rather than multiple issues as was the case in the past. The thought seems to be that if this legislation passes all other legislation will follow in the years to come.  There are meetings with congressmen on the hill, radio and media blitz's, and letter writing campaigns.  This is the DOD Officer's year to get this passed. Anyone wanting additional information or resources to track the progress of this legislation can contact me via PM. There is sources for a paper petition as well as an on-line petition in suport of this legislation.  Let's hope for the sake of the DOD Officers and the safety and security of the Soldiers and Sailors, family members, and federal employee's on the installations that this bill is passed.


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Rumor has it that the Department of the Army is now talking about disbanding it's civilan police force in favor of security guards only.  Don't know how that would effect installations with exclusive jurisdictions and even though it's nothing but rumors,....it's sure is an ugly one.  There would be a serious fight on their hands if that ever happened. 

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Chief_Robe says ...



Rumor has it that the Department of the Army is now talking about disbanding it's civilan police force in favor of security guards only.  Don't know how that would effect installations with exclusive jurisdictions and even though it's nothing but rumors,....it's sure is an ugly one.  There would be a serious fight on their hands if that ever happened. 


 


 


i can see that happening since we are done in Iraq and soon to be done in Afganastan plus buget cuts i can see most of the MP's from the field side going over to PMO and eliminating the need for the civilian cops


Bronzestarribbon_max50

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However it plays it out I support it. 


As far as being "Done" over there, well that is a thread in and of itself.  We will never be done, but I recall, though many years ago that the MP mission had changed to less white hat duty and more field duty, so with the exception of small posts, is it feasible to think the MP mission would change back?  We have a lot of political trip wires out there and I can see them keeping DOD Police, because the war has taken its toll and the ranks of the MP Corp aren't swelling with bodies to perform a dual mission effectively.


Yes, I know the MP Corp has always been small and always we exceeded our mission standards, so no doubt that if that is the standing order the MP's will comply and succeed.  I think we have entered a new battle of sustainment, so DOD Police may have a toe hold for a long time.  Thats a lot of folks out of a job, the Dems wouldn't like that on their records.  Just an opinion...

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curtisk says ...



Chief_Robe says ...



Rumor has it that the Department of the Army is now talking about disbanding it's civilan police force in favor of security guards only.  Don't know how that would effect installations with exclusive jurisdictions and even though it's nothing but rumors,....it's sure is an ugly one.  There would be a serious fight on their hands if that ever happened. 


 


 


i can see that happening since we are done in Iraq and soon to be done in Afganastan plus buget cuts i can see most of the MP's from the field side going over to PMO and eliminating the need for the civilian cops


 


Honestly Brother,..it's not so much about the brothers coming back from theatre,...in my opinion it's about the money the DA will have to fork over.  There's been big time push by lobbyist for the FOP and other organizations in congress to give us constitutional arrest authority.  Especially after Ft Hood incident. Folks are not feeling the change that will come with that. With that authority, the next step is the 20 year retirement,..just like all the other 0083s in the federal government.  That's a lot of cheese to be forking out @ one time. So,..let's just put it this way,....I'm not surprised by the rumor.  



8494_bozo_pd_max600_max50

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I have heard the same rumor, however, I have also heard that this is a rumor that has been floating around to one degree or another for several years. 


The DOD is a lot like the criminals we deal with in that the harder we push, the louder they get.  As we push in a collective effort to get this passed our voices are getting louder.  At the same time, DOD is getting louder to discourage us (my opinion of course).  I am certain there is a mandate that each installation has LE, so they would be hard pressed to convert everyone to security.  They could do it citing that OIS, NCIS, CID, etc are the LE on the installations, however, it would be career suicide for whomever opted to do this. We all know that they do not have the manning to support a full LE mission.  Headlines in papers and on the net across the nation would read Police on Installations disbanded.  Not a positive recruiting effort to say that you don't have LE to protect your own.  On the fiscal side, and I'm going back several years, the average 0083 officer costs less to have around than an E-3.  I'm not sure if that is still the case 10 plus years later.


Our next step in this legislation is to persuade Congressman McKeon (House Armed Forces Committee Chair) to have a legislative hearing on this bill.  This was the recommendation of Representative Filner, who introduced the bill.  If there is no hearing on it, it will die in committee. 


As far as the 20 year (6c) retirement, it is a lot of money at the onset, however, there again there have been cost analysis done on it and they have found that a 6c retirement would help with retention and quality of the workforce and therefore would be cost effective when taking into consideration the retraining needed due to turnover, the elimination of on job injuries that are age related, and a miriad of other reasons. 


All things could be argued pro and con, bottom line is, without 324 passed we are selling our public and the military short.


On a side note, The 6c retirement legislation was re-introduced as well.  It was HR 673 in the 111th congress and is now HR 327 in our current session.


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Chief_Robe says ...



Rumor has it that the Department of the Army is now talking about disbanding it's civilan police force in favor of security guards only.  Don't know how that would effect installations with exclusive jurisdictions and even though it's nothing but rumors,....it's sure is an ugly one.  There would be a serious fight on their hands if that ever happened. 



 



   possible but I doubt it'll leave the rumor mill. It would be a fight tho

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http://www.petitiononline.com/HR324/


 


This is a petition to the united states congress to vote on and sign in to law H.R. 324 last time I checked we had close to 150 people sign this. Please pass this on to the brother hood out there,I also recomend writing your reps. as well as the reps on the armed services commitee. The only way to get this voted on is to cause enough of a ruckus to get the commitee to deal with it one way or another. If we would all stop complaining and get together in one voice and let our reps know where we stand we might be able to lean on them a little we might be able to get it done. If we do nothing the bill will die in committe again. 

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 Come on all you LEO's , help these guys out , you never know when they might save "YOUR LIFE"....


Glory earned on the field of battle , can never be taken away , you take it with you to the grave. Quote by General George Armstrong Custer

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tjlglpd02 says ...



I have heard the same rumor, however, I have also heard that this is a rumor that has been floating around to one degree or another for several years. 


The DOD is a lot like the criminals we deal with in that the harder we push, the louder they get.  As we push in a collective effort to get this passed our voices are getting louder.  At the same time, DOD is getting louder to discourage us (my opinion of course).  I am certain there is a mandate that each installation has LE, so they would be hard pressed to convert everyone to security.  They could do it citing that OIS, NCIS, CID, etc are the LE on the installations, however, it would be career suicide for whomever opted to do this. We all know that they do not have the manning to support a full LE mission.  Headlines in papers and on the net across the nation would read Police on Installations disbanded.  Not a positive recruiting effort to say that you don't have LE to protect your own.  On the fiscal side, and I'm going back several years, the average 0083 officer costs less to have around than an E-3.  I'm not sure if that is still the case 10 plus years later.


Our next step in this legislation is to persuade Congressman McKeon (House Armed Forces Committee Chair) to have a legislative hearing on this bill.  This was the recommendation of Representative Filner, who introduced the bill.  If there is no hearing on it, it will die in committee. 


As far as the 20 year (6c) retirement, it is a lot of money at the onset, however, there again there have been cost analysis done on it and they have found that a 6c retirement would help with retention and quality of the workforce and therefore would be cost effective when taking into consideration the retraining needed due to turnover, the elimination of on job injuries that are age related, and a miriad of other reasons. 


All things could be argued pro and con, bottom line is, without 324 passed we are selling our public and the military short.


On a side note, The 6c retirement legislation was re-introduced as well.  It was HR 673 in the 111th congress and is now HR 327 in our current session.



 


No 0083 is not cheaper then an E-3 as an E-3 i made about 21,000 last year this is from an add for a 0083 at Camp Lejeune


salary range $31,315 - $50,431 Per year


plus they have to be paid overtime

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Dollars and cents you are right, now, add to that your comrats, BAH, dental, health, vision, spousal support, retirement, 3 year rotation and re-training etc.  When I talk about cost effectiveness, I am talking about the whole package, not just the pay. 


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true you may be right once you count all of that but.... when there is no place left for the field mp's to deploy to they will just be sitting around still getting paid while the gov. pays somebody else to do their job but that really isnt my big issue here to me it sounds like this bill is going to give the DOD police more athority on  military bases then the military police which makes no sence what so ever to me. as far as the DOD police that work at the mint or other places then a military base im all for giving them the other powers

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Problem is, even though its so misinterpreted and taken out of context without considering the history, Posse Comatatus binds your hands.  This isn't an us vs them thing. Why wouldn't it make sense for a police officer to have authority? This is a law that would better protect the military families and military members on the installations and adjacent jurisdictions.  Not sure how long you've been an Officer or how much patrol you've done, but it really sucks when we have to give  a 72 hour bar letter to a guy with a warrant for a felony because of our lack of statutory authority.  Sucks even worse when the adjacent jurisdiction calls and says they have 9 gang bangers at gunpoint a block away from you with only 1 officer on scene and you can't go out and cover your brother in blue because of the statutory thing.  Even worse is when you are 1/4th block from a skirmish that breaks out and you watch one of the guys get stabbed to death, knowing you could have stopped it but wern't allowed to because of regulation.


As far as manning when MP's come back from the field...we've worked along side of them before, and will again.  The numbers will even out through attrition so nobody will be sitting around doing nothing.


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Dear brothers in blue, please help our cause... see attached petition...


http://www.petitiononline.com/HR324/petition.

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Chief_Robe says ...



Rumor has it that the Department of the Army is now talking about disbanding it's civilan police force in favor of security guards only.  Don't know how that would effect installations with exclusive jurisdictions and even though it's nothing but rumors,....it's sure is an ugly one.  There would be a serious fight on their hands if that ever happened. 



Rumors are just that.  Look at USAJOBS and there are a few 0083 postings for army and air force.


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there are a lot of spots where it wouldn't be possible for Military police units to be stationed because there are not a lot of soldiers there. There are 0083's everywhere and lots of us are perminant employee's what would they do with all of us if they suddenly fold up are department?

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they would never just get rid of all the  0083's it would look bad for them just putting all of those guys out of a job IF they did anything they would just slowly let them retire or move on to other things on their own and not look to replace them. but a buddy of mine has been saying that on some bases they are trying to go completly 0083's and not have any MP's their

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Petition signed.

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See whats going on  in Africa and the middle east right now, if there weren't MP's in Afghanistan and Iraq right now they would be ramping up to go some where else. I know I was a MP beofre the Iraq drama kicked off my unit was deployed every other year or so anyway. You need people that are experts in the field that have in service training and who have been to a accredited Police Academy, who arn't being streched by all these deployments.

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A fellow officer on the Officer.com forums posted an update from FOP on their efforts.


www.fop.net/legislative/issues/hr218/FOCmemo20110304.pdf

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Chief_Robe says ...



Rumor has it that the Department of the Army is now talking about disbanding it's civilan police force in favor of security guards only.  Don't know how that would effect installations with exclusive jurisdictions and even though it's nothing but rumors,....it's sure is an ugly one.  There would be a serious fight on their hands if that ever happened


 


Well in response to any branch of the military disbanding 0083's for 0085's or contract security guards, there is a DOD directive that say's there will be no 0085's or contract security guards performing law enforcement duties on any DOD installation, they can perform gate duty/access control. I guess the question would be if that DOD directive will be amended so that the DOA can accomplish what i am hearing.


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As a former active duty MP I was never clear on why they would spend all that extra money to pay DOD police anyway. As many MPs as are on an installation.


Pain is weakness leaving the body.

Obstacles are what we see when we take our eyes off the goal.

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KSP494 says ...



As a former active duty MP I was never clear on why they would spend all that extra money to pay DOD police anyway. As many MPs as are on an installation.



not to mention the other guys that are not MP's that get sent over to work at pmo

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KSP494 says ...



As a former active duty MP I was never clear on why they would spend all that extra money to pay DOD police anyway. As many MPs as are on an installation.



There is a variety of reasons.  One is cost effectiveness (see my above post).  Another is stability.  We are around for many years vs the military guys who are assigned overseas and transfer around the country.  As you are aware as a former MP we need to adhere to 32 CFR.  This means we need to know and understand state law as well as UCMJ and Federal Statute.  On a 3 to 4 year rotation a military person may just be getting familiar with all the nuances of the state laws when they are moved to a different state.  Another cited reason is lack of intimidation.  Although I am not so ready to agree that this would be a main point of arguement, I have seen it firsthand where officers and NCO's use their rank in an attempt to intimidate the young impressionable sailors, soldiers, and airmen. 


 


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