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Corrections Officers-Concealed Carry

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Posted over 5 years ago

 

Should corrections officers that are not sworn in be allowed to carry a concealed weapon? There is a new petition going around in Illinois to amend the Police Training Act to allow corrections officers to conceal carry while off duty. I have heard good arguments supporting both sides of the issue. My stance stays the same as we corrections officers should be allowed to protect our families if we should encounter a former detainee on the street.  We also get state training on the handling and safety of firearms, so we would be in a good situation to assist the public if something bad happened while we are out. Please voice your opinion in this subject. Thanks

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Rate This | Posted over 5 years ago

 

I have to agree with you. I think we should be allowed to carry conceled off duty. My thinking is the more guns in the right hands are better than the guns in the wrong hands.


I brought an extra can of whoop ass just in case!

J___m_2_max50

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Rated +1 | Posted over 5 years ago

 

I do think the Correction Officers should be able to carry off duty.  Myself and my husband both have a concealed weapons license, we do not leave home without our gun.  I have come in contact with former inmates while out woth my family.  So having a weapon to protect yourself just in case you get that one inmate who wants to retaliate against you, is better then not having anything to protect you. 

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Rated +1 | Posted about 5 years ago

 

I am a Corrections Officer myself in the state of Kansas and truly feel that all Corrections Officers should be allowed to carry a concealed weapon while not on duty. This would not only allow us to protect ourselves, but it would also allow us to protect our families as well. I was assaulted my an inmate while I was on duty and to this day I feel that I should have the right to defend myself if the situation were to arise once I was off duty and headed to my POV or even on the way home.

Mastiff_difraia_max50

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Rated +1 | Posted about 5 years ago

 

 Sworn or not, if they expect you guys to take care of business inside the walls, you should be able to protect your own outside.  

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Rate This | Posted about 5 years ago

 

Absolutely.


People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf. George Orwell

Don_27t_20tred_20on_20me_max50

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Rate This | Posted about 5 years ago

 

No, I think if you are not sworn, you should have to go through the same hoops like everyone else.


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Rated +1 | Posted about 5 years ago

 

I think the more important question here is... why are the not sworn?  I think if you are not sworn, you should have the same rights as John Q Citizen.  I also think that Corrections Officers SHOULD be sworn.

Don_27t_20tred_20on_20me_max50

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Rate This | Posted about 5 years ago

 

Corpsman says ...



I think the more important question here is... why are the not sworn? 



Because it costs the state more money to swear in every C/O and jailer as a sworn peace officer...


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Rate This | Posted about 5 years ago

 

Riot says ...



Corpsman says ...



I think the more important question here is... why are the not sworn? 



Because it costs the state more money to swear in every C/O and jailer as a sworn peace officer...



It always comes down to the almighty dollar!


PL Mentoring Team Member

My day begins when yours ends.

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Rated +1 | Posted about 5 years ago

 

Yes! If the department expects it's officers to use firearms on duty, trains them and requires regular range qualification.


The above comments are soley those of the poster and in no way reflect the position of the Department of Corrections.

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Rate This | Posted about 5 years ago

 

Thats a problem we really need to sworn. Its crazy how the state will let us carry while we are doing thier bidding but leave us high and dry once we take the uniform off.


In Maryland where I work you need 2 documented threats to get a CCP. Even with those two documented threats you still might not get your permit.Its all up to the state police who gets one or not. The sheriff's office I use to work for would not help you at all to get your permit.They would not provide documention of the threats and would not even give you a letter stating that you were an employee. In thier policy it even said the sheriff does not support the idea of corrections officers having CCPs and the sheriff's office will not give you any help to obtain one. Living 5mins from the jail and opening my door and seeing ex-inmates everwhere always gave me an uneasy feeling.


Where I work now its alot easier to get a permit and the sheriff''s office will support you however they can.The laws in Maryland need to change though so all of us are protected when we are outside the walls.


 


 

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Rate This | Posted about 5 years ago

 

HapkidoKa says ...



Yes! If the department expects it's officers to use firearms on duty, trains them and requires regular range qualification.



You opened up a can of worms, though...having said that, why not let security officers concealed carry as well?


 


Why? Because they're not sworn Peace Officers...if we (Correction Officers) aren't sworn- we shouldn't be able to carry concealed unless we get a CCW permit like anyone else. We are no better or worse than any other citizen on the street...having said that I still think there should be National reciprocity for civilians.


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Rate This | Posted about 5 years ago

 

No concealed carry in Illinois. Not even for citizens.


I brought an extra can of whoop ass just in case!

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Rate This | Posted about 5 years ago

 

Riot says ...



HapkidoKa says ...



Yes! If the department expects it's officers to use firearms on duty, trains them and requires regular range qualification.



You opened up a can of worms, though...having said that, why not let security officers concealed carry as well?


 


Why? Because they're not sworn Peace Officers...if we (Correction Officers) aren't sworn- we shouldn't be able to carry concealed unless we get a CCW permit like anyone else. We are no better or worse than any other citizen on the street...having said that I still think there should be National reciprocity for civilians.



Riot while you have a valid point and I think we both agree that all Americans should be afforded the opportunity to CCW and that all members of LE should be peace officers both on and off duty even if their authority is limited to certain demographics. Now back to your question about security, we can take it further and look at HR 218. What seperates a retired LEO from the rest of society? What seperates an off duty LEO from anyone else when outside his jurisdiction? What seperates one LEO from another?


If I could go apply for a CCW permit I wouldn't discuss this issue but only thugs, Alermen and some cops get to CCW in IL.


The above comments are soley those of the poster and in no way reflect the position of the Department of Corrections.

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Rate This | Posted about 5 years ago

 

scaci598 says ...



Should corrections officers that are not sworn in be allowed to carry a concealed weapon? There is a new petition going around in Illinois to amend the Police Training Act to allow corrections officers to conceal carry while off duty. I have heard good arguments supporting both sides of the issue. My stance stays the same as we corrections officers should be allowed to protect our families if we should encounter a former detainee on the street.  We also get state training on the handling and safety of firearms, so we would be in a good situation to assist the public if something bad happened while we are out. Please voice your opinion in this subject. Thanks



While I don't think this would apply to me sine the Police Training Act applies to local gov and not state, I'd like more info on this petition.


The above comments are soley those of the poster and in no way reflect the position of the Department of Corrections.

Don_27t_20tred_20on_20me_max50

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Rate This | Posted about 5 years ago

 

HapkidoKa says ...



Riot while you have a valid point and I think we both agree that all Americans should be afforded the opportunity to CCW and that all members of LE should be peace officers both on and off duty even if their authority is limited to certain demographics. Now back to your question about security, we can take it further and look at HR 218. What seperates a retired LEO from the rest of society? What seperates an off duty LEO from anyone else when outside his jurisdiction? What seperates one LEO from another?


If I could go apply for a CCW permit I wouldn't discuss this issue but only thugs, Alermen and some cops get to CCW in IL.



 


Hap, quick question- are you a sworn Peace Officer? My training as an MP was 10 times of that than here working for DOC. Heck, even when I was a Nuclear Security Officer we had more familiarization training with the state laws than I have had here working as a C/O. My "academy" consisted of a LOT of classroom time talking about NIMS and the history of prisons when more focus should have been on defensive tactics, the laws and rules that govern detained/incarcerated persons and the Use of Force Continuum. All we did was a lot of written tests, play with a radio, and then get sprayed in the face (which, btw, wasn't mandatory- only suggested). My firearms instruction was the EXACT SAME as that given for armed security officers...in fact, my certificate even states that I passed the firearms course for armed security or private investigator!
So, again...do I think some security officer should fall under HR 218? No, I do not...that form was specifically for those that are sworn to protect.
Don't get me wrong Hap, I think we should be Sworn Peace Officers...I think C/Os should have to follow the same standards and guidelines as any other LEO and I think we should be paid the same. I also think that when a C/O gets assaulted, the offender should be charged as if he assaulted a Law Enforcement Officer on the street. However, the background, psychological and physical fitness standards for C/Os are less than that of any LEO agency that I know of...so, again, it's a double-sided knife here. I think if we want to be treated the same as LEOs, we should be held to the same standards...granted this is also coming from a guy that can probably run circles around 95% of all the employees in this institution. Maybe when I'm 55 and want a job sitting in a gun tower starring at a wall, I'd feel differently about those standards....but the fact still remains, LEOs get the training that we don't get and, therefore, should get the privileges that we don't deserve.
 


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Rate This | Posted about 5 years ago

 

Riot says ...



HapkidoKa says ...



Riot while you have a valid point and I think we both agree that all Americans should be afforded the opportunity to CCW and that all members of LE should be peace officers both on and off duty even if their authority is limited to certain demographics. Now back to your question about security, we can take it further and look at HR 218. What seperates a retired LEO from the rest of society? What seperates an off duty LEO from anyone else when outside his jurisdiction? What seperates one LEO from another?


If I could go apply for a CCW permit I wouldn't discuss this issue but only thugs, Alermen and some cops get to CCW in IL.



 


Hap, quick question- are you a sworn Peace Officer? My training as an MP was 10 times of that than here working for DOC. Heck, even when I was a Nuclear Security Officer we had more familiarization training with the state laws than I have had here working as a C/O. My "academy" consisted of a LOT of classroom time talking about NIMS and the history of prisons when more focus should have been on defensive tactics, the laws and rules that govern detained/incarcerated persons and the Use of Force Continuum. All we did was a lot of written tests, play with a radio, and then get sprayed in the face (which, btw, wasn't mandatory- only suggested). My firearms instruction was the EXACT SAME as that given for armed security officers...in fact, my certificate even states that I passed the firearms course for armed security or private investigator!
So, again...do I think some security officer should fall under HR 218? No, I do not...that form was specifically for those that are sworn to protect.
Don't get me wrong Hap, I think we should be Sworn Peace Officers...I think C/Os should have to follow the same standards and guidelines as any other LEO and I think we should be paid the same. I also think that when a C/O gets assaulted, the offender should be charged as if he assaulted a Law Enforcement Officer on the street. However, the background, psychological and physical fitness standards for C/Os are less than that of any LEO agency that I know of...so, again, it's a double-sided knife here. I think if we want to be treated the same as LEOs, we should be held to the same standards...granted this is also coming from a guy that can probably run circles around 95% of all the employees in this institution. Maybe when I'm 55 and want a job sitting in a gun tower starring at a wall, I'd feel differently about those standards....but the fact still remains, LEOs get the training that we don't get and, therefore, should get the privileges that we don't deserve.
 

In the protection, arrest and retaking of commited persons I have the full authority of a peace officer. The state DOC is also recognized by the state as a Law Enforcement Agency. I agree with you 100% and if not for my tactical and outside training I don't think I'd be the officer I am. Now while I feel we should all be peace officers even if only in relation to cons and with that the bar should be raised when it comes to training and standards.


The above comments are soley those of the poster and in no way reflect the position of the Department of Corrections.

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Rate This | Posted about 5 years ago

 

Riot, you and Hap both have very valid points. However, I have learned from being a memeber of PL how training varies from state to state. It pains me to know that of the 50 states in the union only a handfull give thier Correction Officers full police powers. On my last day of agency training I was along with my classmates sworn in and took an oath of office. It is extremly difficult to get hired in NJ as most of the lists are filled with those having veterans status, which they more then deserve. In saying that, I feel that being sworn as a C/O and having statutory authority 24 hours a day 7 days a week is a privilage that is not to be taken lightly. I worked hard for my job and DO NOT take my authority for granted. In a nutshell, if I am out and about, policy dictates that I leave the police work to the police outside of the jail BUT state law grants me the powers to act if a crime is commited in my presence and there are no other LEO's around which I am prepared and trained to do. In closing, I never leave my house without my badge, cuffs and my weapon....like the old adage says, better to have and not need then to need and not have......just my 2 cents

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Rate This | Posted about 5 years ago

 

HR 218 allows sworn officers to carry, non sworn, sorry 218 does not cover you.


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Rate This | Posted almost 5 years ago

 

Missouri gives its officers the option of being sworn/certified but, you have to take the written & physical exams over again plus there is another catch. The catch is... if you don't keep up with the certification after being sworn you can be disciplined & even fired for default within the department. If thier gonna spend the almighty dollar they want you kept as current as possible. Being sworn here doesn't mean you have the EXACT same duties as a police officer. Our duties are limited but become full if outside law enforcement calls upon us. This was instated in January for us. PROOF PROGRESS IS BEING MADE!


Don't forget... the toes you step on today might be attached to the ass you'll be kissing tomorrow!

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Rate This | Posted about 4 years ago

 

ok I have a question


 


I am a CO here in Arizona and I remember whe I graduate I took the OTHA and reading in my certificate says


 


"Has sussesfully completed the Arizona POST approved Basic Correctional Officers"


this certificate is signed by the Director of DOC, Academy Commander and Executive Director of the Arizona Peace Officer Standars and training board.


said that do I am post certified or not?


Can any one help me with that?


I can carry firearms offduty with my credential but I also know Arizona is gun friendly so I am confuse


 

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Rate This | Posted about 4 years ago

 

dssboy92250 says ...



ok I have a question


 


I am a CO here in Arizona and I remember whe I graduate I took the OTHA and reading in my certificate says


 


"Has sussesfully completed the Arizona POST approved Basic Correctional Officers"


this certificate is signed by the Director of DOC, Academy Commander and Executive Director of the Arizona Peace Officer Standars and training board.


said that do I am post certified or not?


Can any one help me with that?


I can carry firearms offduty with my credential but I also know Arizona is gun friendly so I am confuse


 



I believe, and I may be wrong, that POST certification as  a Corrections Officer is different that POST cetification as a Law Enforcement Officer, as to whether you can carry concealed based on your AZ  POST Correctional Officer certification is something i do not know, it wouldn't work in KS or MO, but i don't know about  AZ.

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Rate This | Posted about 4 years ago

 

I am a POST certified LEO in my state and I am a probation and parole officer. Here is Louisiana's standards (briefly)


Minimum Training Requirements

All full-time peace officers, as defined in R.S.40:2402, shall complete a basic training course as prescribed and certified by the Council on Peace Officers Standards. Reserve or part-time officers or military police officers stationed in Louisiana may be eligible for certification if they successfully complete a basic training course prescribed for full-time peace officers and pass the POST statewide examination. There are three levels of POST Certification:


Level 1 - Certification for Basic Law Enforcement Peace Officers


The student will complete a training course with a minimum of 360 hours for full certification. Level 1 certification requires that the student meet the POSTrequirements for firearm certification.


Level 2 - Certification for Basic Correctional Peace Officer


The student will complete a training course with a minimum of 249 hours and is limited to those peace officers whose duties are the care, custody, and control of inmates. The training course consists of the core curriculum plus a sufficient number of hours to obtain POST certification. POST Firearm certification for Level 2 students is required. (eff in 2001)


Level 3 - Certification for Jailer Training Officers


The student will complete a training course with a minimum of 90 hours and is limited to those correctional officers whose duties are the care, custody, andcontrol of inmates. This course consists of the core correctional officer curriculum. POST Firearm certification for Level 3 students is not required.


Students must adhere to all standards, rules and regulations established by the accredited training center. Certification is not awarded to students who are physically unable to complete every aspect of the basic training course.


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Rate This | Posted about 4 years ago

 

Here ya go, this is the link for Az. http://www.azsos.gov/public_services/title_13/13-04.htm


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Rate This | Posted about 4 years ago

 

Maybe this may help shed some light.... but you are still subject to department rules.. http://www.mdsp.org/downloads/LEOSA_2004.pdf


Above all, we must realize that no arsenal, or no weapon in the arsenals of the world, is so formidable as the will and moral courage of free men and women. It is a weapon our adversaries in today’s world do not have.

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Rate This | Posted about 4 years ago

 

MidmoCo. Once licensed always licensed in Missouri. There is no option. One does not continue to take examinations to stay licensed. One has to only keep their continuing education current to stay licensed. I have been retired for four years and my license is still current. I keep my hours current.

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Rate This | Posted about 4 years ago

 

Come to AZ. Starting on Thursday ANYONE can carry concealed without a permit.


Being a police officer is like having a front row seat to the greatest show on earth.

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Rate This | Posted about 4 years ago

 

dssboy92250 says ...



ok I have a question


 


I am a CO here in Arizona and I remember whe I graduate I took the OTHA and reading in my certificate says


 


"Has sussesfully completed the Arizona POST approved Basic Correctional Officers"


this certificate is signed by the Director of DOC, Academy Commander and Executive Director of the Arizona Peace Officer Standars and training board.


said that do I am post certified or not?


Can any one help me with that?


I can carry firearms offduty with my credential but I also know Arizona is gun friendly so I am confuse


 



You are a POST certified Correctional Officer not Police Officer. Hope that answers your question. PEace Officer and LEO are like umbrellas and there are several different job titles under them from CO to PO to Court Officer etc etc etc.


The above comments are soley those of the poster and in no way reflect the position of the Department of Corrections.

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Rate This | Posted about 4 years ago

 

well....i guess i will chime in on this one too with some personal feelings.


 


while im from PA and have had the privelege of having my CCW permit for 10+ years now, i feel that COs SHOULD be able to carry off duty.....with the proper credentials. i totally agree with having to identify who you are when/if sh*t hit the fan.


 


granted, i have not been through the academy yet, but i have a general idea of what to expect when i do get there. and it sounds like i will get (even more) formal training in firearms both at the academy and in-house. so my feeling would be....as long as you get the formal training, have your ID, and carrying a weapon youre certified to use....then why not? me personally.....i dont see that much of a difference between COs and POs. the police officers arrest them.....the correctional officers detain them......we all deal with criminals. we are all on the same side working towards the same goals. the only thing that separates us is title. not too sure why there seems to be opposing viewpoints between the POs here and the COs. the second word in all the titles that i can think of is "officer."


 


just my .02 cents.

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