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Marine who criticized Obama on Facebook should be dismissed: panel

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Anonymous

over 2 years ago

0 articles submitted

Source: Reuters


April 07, 2012


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  • 200px-underdog_max50

    DNelson4817

    over 2 years ago

    96 Comments

    At the most I see a administrative discharge... as in any law elements of the crime must be met no different with the UCMJ. Gary Stein is a Sergeant what charges could he face? Some say "insubordinate conduct. Art 91 UCMJ: INSUBORDINATE CONDUCT TOWARD WARRANT OFFICER, NONCOMMISSIONED OFFICER, OR PETTY OFFICER
    Any warrant officer or enlisted member who--
    (1) strikes or assaults a warrant officer, noncommissioned officer, or petty officer, while that officer is in the execution of his office;
    (2) willfully disobeys the lawful order of a warrant officer, noncommissioned officer, or petty officer; or
    (3) treats with contempt or is disrespectful in language or deportment toward a warrant officer, noncommissioned officer, or petty officer while that officer is in the execution of his office;
    shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.

    Sergeant Stein actions do not meet the elements of Art 91.

    ART. 92. FAILURE TO OBEY ORDER OR REGULATION
    Any person subject to this chapter who--
    (1) violates or fails to obey any lawful general order or regulation;
    (2) having knowledge of any other lawful order issued by any member of the armed forces, which it is his duty to obey, fails to obey the order; or
    (3) is derelict in the performance of his duties;
    shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.

    Sergeant Stein's actions perhaps falls into this category as he was previously ordered to in 2010 to write a disclaiimer that the Armed Forces Tea Party is not affiliated with the Armed Forces.

    Other UCMJ Art Sergeant Stein could have violated is ART. 94. MUTINY OR SEDITION
    (a) Any person subject to this chapter who--
    (1) with intent to usurp or override lawful military authority, refuses, in concert with any other person, to obey orders or otherwise do his duty or creates any violence or disturbance is guilty of mutiny;
    (2) with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of lawful civil authority, creates, in concert with any other person, revolt, violence, or disturbance against that authority is guilty of sedition;
    (3) fails to do his utmost to prevent and suppress a mutiny or sedition being committed in his presence, or fails to take all reasonable means to inform his superior commissioned officer or commanding officer of a mutiny or sedition which he knows or has reason to believe is taking place, is guilty of a failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition.
    (b) A person who is found guilty of attempted mutiny, mutiny, sedition, or failure to suppress or report a mutiny or sedition shall be punished by death or such other punishment as a court- martial may direct.

    Again, Segeant Stein's actions would have had to have been "in concert with any other person" probably not hard to do posting on a face book page with other active duty military. But the end result would be what his actions are when it was time to carry them out.

  • 1asteriskshield_ezr_max50

    ajsdaddyBPD

    over 2 years ago

    3080 Comments

    I believe sargencharge got it right......arrogance.

  • 1979_max50

    Robocop33

    over 2 years ago

    14618 Comments

    Before any civilians start to say the military can be used to 'subdue' criticisms of the American people and be ordered to take them into custody or even seize their guns etc. THAT is an unlawful order and the military can and they will refuse to follow that order. This is not WWII Germany where the leaders of the military were appointed by the leader from thugs that followed him in his rise to power. Our military are appointed from the ranks and they are well versed in Constitutional Law and that is the ONE area where they are not only allowed to refuse the President, they are bound to refuse him and refuse him they will. That is why the President is trying to ban firearms through the courts and change parts of the Constitution. There will be no burning of the Congress or 'night of the long knives' or even 'Krystalle Nicht" here in the USA.

  • Img_0048_max50

    sargeNcharge

    over 2 years ago

    596 Comments

    from boot camp to whatever agency you currently work for, we all know that are personal thoughts are just that....personal...we are here to enforce policy,law, ect., not make it,offer opinions on it ect....i don't know if it was his arrogence or ignorance...as soon as he was informed of the situation he should have removed the material..it probably would not have mushroomed to this level....even some of the senior most officers in the service like Generals have been dismissed for either criticzicing or making comments about the President..and as a Sergeant he apparently thinks he can......come on man.........

  • Ba_old_glory_max50

    Jonas

    over 2 years ago

    42222 Comments

    bump Dave.

  • Photo_user_blank_big

    Anonymous

    over 2 years ago

    Bump Dave and Gradyg! There are somethings civilians just don't understand! God Bless our Military! Past, Present, and Future! Our Military is our future, regardless of politics! Our military is the staple that keeps this country together!

  • Photo_user_blank_big

    Anonymous

    over 2 years ago

    Since almost all the way back to the Cro Magnon man everybody in the uniform of his or her country is ,or shouild be,cognizant of the fact that there are specific rules/regulations that one must abide by.As Steve has so wisely advised the chain of command MUST be abided by or surely there would be unbridled chaos.This is true in ALL forms of government and has nothing whatsoever to do with politicsIf this individual didn't like the service why did this individual enlist.There hasn't been a draft for decades.

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    Anonymous

    over 2 years ago

    Bump Robo, it as it should be! We and many others honored our contract and bowed out gracefully! As private citizens we could finally speak our mind about whatever issues were on our minds at that time!

    The military does not have the ability to voice their opinions as American citizens do. They and we signed up to protect the rights of those Americans to use the very rights we signed up for and abdicated for Americans to protect!

  • Derrick_max50

    gradyg

    over 2 years ago

    1118 Comments

    I meant thumbs up, and that is a weak argument about his first amendment rights being violated. We who have served in the military knows that your first amendment rights is limited to not what you say but how you say it.

  • Derrick_max50

    gradyg

    over 2 years ago

    1118 Comments

    You criticize the Commander in Chief you get fired just like if you criticize your boss at work you get fired the same rules apply. You can not go to work and do and say what you like, the military is about discipline, honor and respect, when I served you dare not criticize those that are appointed over you policy and rules are put into place for a reason, just like any paramilitary organization that you swore to and if you break the rules you suffer the consequences of your action. You would think this guy being a NCO would have known better. Now he is about to get a dishonorably discharge and lose all forefeiture of pay, dummy.

  • 1979_max50

    Robocop33

    over 2 years ago

    14618 Comments

    I totally agree with Steven on this. He is not being kicked out for 'Honorable' service. He is lucky that they didn't give him an undesirable or Bad Conduct paper. Like Steven said, what he is doing is intolerable and cannot be allowed. As Steven had an issue with Clinto, I had an issue with Jimmy Carter and I did the same, I did not re-enlist but took my Discharge and then proceeded to complain. Also understand that when you joined the military you give up many of your rights. They own you. If you are given an order to storm a position with everyone knowing that your chance of survival are less than 20% you do it. You cannot say that hey Sarge, four out of five of us are going to get killed and I don't want to do this so I am not going.

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    Anonymous

    over 2 years ago

    Matt,

    Yes, he can! He can blog all he wants as a private citizen! I have sent many soldiers home with discharges they believed they should not have gotten for many different reasons, and told them the Army/Military is not for everyone. Nevertheless, I thanked them for their service.

  • Crumb_passin_thru_02_1__max50

    mz66

    over 2 years ago

    3852 Comments

    That makes sense (and should've been obvious), Steven. Thanks.

    I imagine he can write his own ticket now, anyway--not in the military, but in the neocon blogosphere.

  • Photo_user_blank_big

    Anonymous

    over 2 years ago

    Matt,

    The harm would be that an individual would be able to get out of military service by being insubordinate. Insubordinance is punished by the UCMJ. To allow this behavior to be rewarded by discharging an individual with benefits would be reckless and detrimental to order and discipline.

  • Photo_user_blank_big

    Anonymous

    over 2 years ago

    Ajs, I hear ya! I drank and will continue to drink the juice! Any crack in the chain is one crack too many! This marine's (small m), behavior is unacceptable! I had my issues with President Clinton and I quitely retired!

    Our military as you know cannot tolerate insubordination. How many times was this individual given a break and told to tone it down. He continued and he gets what he gets! Run up on your Chief and see how far it gets you or anyone's boss be they civilian or military!

    I thank him for his service but one screwup, and he has had more than one, erases countless commendations!

    Unfortunately, it is what it is, and I support the panels decision.

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